Saturday, 2014-07-26

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tgnitbkuhn: greetings!16:43
bkuhnGreetings, tgnit !16:44
bkuhnI just got back from OSCON yesterday mornign!16:44
bkuhnI see I have an email from you, which I admittedly haven't read, but I saw tbm suggested it be moved to the mailing list.16:44
bkuhnHas the discussion now moved there?16:44
bkuhntgnit: I have to go idle for a bit.  I'm still in the same room (my apartment is basically one room) but I'm cooking breakfast for my wife, so I won't be terribly responsive for an hour or two.16:47
tgnitbkuhn: yes,  we are discussing there, but it is a status update so i will prefer to discuss with you !16:49
bkuhnUnderstood.  When are you going offline today?16:50
tgnitbkuhn:  you proceed, have a happy time cooking :)16:50
tgniti am online for next few hours16:51
tgnitbkuhn:  after next 3-4 hrs16:51
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bkuhntgnit: So, first of all, I am impressed at the way you're handling the email thread with John and Martin18:33
bkuhntgnit: Seriously, you deserve a compliment:  your writing on the list reads like a professional Free Software developer's would.  I am very impressed.18:33
bkuhnBut, your question is a good one:18:33
bkuhnThis feature is very complicated.  The new point that you all got to yesterday that we need to have the rounding option based on commodity type is likely  the right approach.18:34
bkuhnI agree with what you're hinting at: it could easily take you the rest of your GSoC time to try to get this right, and even then, there might not be enough time.18:34
bkuhnSo ultimately, we have a decision to make about how your final time is spent.18:34
bkuhnDo you have an opinion on that?18:34
tgnitbkuhn; thanks for the compliment  :), i am too much into this feature and whenever try something new, i feel i am really close.18:38
bkuhntgnit: Some problems can be "addictive" like that.  Like gambling: you always feel you're "just about" to win.18:38
bkuhnBut, my read on this is that if we keep digging here, we've spent the rest of your GSoC time on it.18:39
bkuhnThis doesn't necessarily bother me, but I'd like your input on what you'd like to do: would you rather do that or work on tests?18:39
tgnitbkuhn: you are right,  it can take time longer than expected.18:39
bkuhnI don't think it's as close as you think.18:39
bkuhnI suspect you have another few days of time discussing in more detail with John.  I suspect when you go and try to implement the per-commodity version of what you've done, John will have a lot of comments that will come back and indicate a redesign.18:40
tgnitbkuhn:  i got you, so i think it is better to move on18:40
bkuhnIt may take up to a week to understand his comments, etc.18:40
bkuhntgnit: before you decide that: Note that you will learn a lot if you push this further.18:40
bkuhnSo, while you'll learn a good things about test writing and test suites in the last few weeks if you switch tasks completely now.18:41
bkuhn.... you may miss out on what you might learn about more advanced problem-solving in a Free Software community.18:41
bkuhnMy decision would be heavily influenced by what skills would likely be most useful to you.18:41
tgnitbkuhn:  what is your opinion?18:42
bkuhnI don't have a strong opinion.18:42
bkuhnI worry that if you don't finish this feature, no one else will pick it up.18:42
bkuhnBecause, ultimately, tbm and I have various work-arounds we've been using to avoid the rounding problems...18:42
bkuhn... so it's not urgently needed.18:42
bkuhnSo if you abandon that work now, we won't get that feature for possibly years, frankly.18:43
bkuhnI'm also annoyed that there isn't a larger test suite for ledger-cli.18:43
bkuhnThus, I'm very ambivalent.18:43
tgnitthen i think i will like to continue with it and finish it irrespective of gsoc.18:43
bkuhnThat's why I leave it to you to judge what skills you'd like to develop with your remaining time.18:43
bkuhntgnit: That definitely changes things: if you're willing to see this feature through AFTER GSoC, then it's *definitely* worth the time for you to spend your time on it.18:44
tgnitbkuhn:  is it fine if i write fewer tests than expected?18:44
bkuhntgnit: but you must consider how your motivation will change: We talk a lot in Free Software about volunteerism, etc., but even those of us, who, like me, believe deeply in volunteering our time to make projects better... we all still admit that sometimes, when you're not being paid, it's tough to get motivated.18:45
bkuhn... And no one would blame you if you stopped after GSoC ended.18:45
bkuhnSo, you should think about that factor of motivation and ability to transition paid work to volunteer work in your assessment of continuing.18:45
bkuhnI've met many people who intended to keep volunteering after their paid time ended (both in GSoC and in other contexts)... rarely does it happen, frankly, even with the best people.18:45
bkuhnSo, think that issue over for a few days.18:45
tgnitbkuhn : i understand,  also after gsoc i am going to pick a job18:46
bkuhnwhich of course changes your available time. :)18:46
bkuhntgnit: As for tests, yes, if you are making real progress on the feature and keep posting to the mailing list and discussing it with johnw and tbm, then I'm ok with you writing fewer tests.18:46
bkuhnBut, in the event that you *don't* finish the feature, it's now more important than ever that your work be publicly documented and discussed on the mailing list.18:47
bkuhnWe're not going to decide pass/fail based on whether this feature gets finished: I recognize that it's difficult and I will be impressed at this point if you get it merged upstream before the end of GSoC.18:47
tgnitbkuhn:  towards the end, i will document more things publicly,  meanwhile i comment on code and commits18:48
bkuhnBut if you continue with working on the feature and it doesn't complete by "pencils down" time, then you need to have something to show for your work.  That material will be your mailing list thread and your own git repository with all your attempts.  So you need to have lots of that for me and tbm to make a final review.18:48
bkuhnGreat, I think you understand.18:48
bkuhnGive a few more days to work and think, let's talk again on (my) Monday (morning) about this.18:49
bkuhnand see how you're feeling about it then.18:49
bkuhnAnd make a final decision about the rest of your GSoC at that point.18:49
bkuhntgnit: does that sound like a good plan to you?18:49
tgnitbkuhn:  there are lot of things which ends in error so they are not in the commits,  i made sure that whatever i commit compiles18:50
tgnitbkuhn:  got it,  its good18:50
bkuhnGreat, let's chat again Monday, then.18:50
tgnitand errors and learning have taken more time,  i am unsure how you will feel about it. so its better i get it reviewed by you regularly.18:51
bkuhnAgreed.  I'm sorry I've done less code review than I would have liked of your work.  If you want to submit a bunch of URLs of comments/commits that you specifically want my review of on Monday, then please do.18:51
tgnitbkuhn: ok,  one good news, i fixed the code coverage problem, the option ledger earlier had is working fine now18:52
tgnitbkuhn:  sure,  see you around on Monday18:53
tgnitbkuhn:  :)18:53
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